Print

Print


Those fastidious about NCNC should hit the Delete button now.

Those allergic to rants should hit the Delete button now.

I read that article now having nothing else to do, and I didn't believe my
eyes. Hasn't the author understood anything? Tolkien's Elves can do evil,
and at least the Noldor outright rebelled against the Valar. While it's
true that an inordinate amount of Elvish evil was committed by or at the
ultimate instigation of Feanor even Galadriel rebelled and was banned from
the West, only to be redeemed by her instrumental help in overthrowing
Sauron, and also I suspect because she rejected the Ring. The interesting
thing is that unlike Men the Elves, least of all Feanor, willingly lend
their ears and hands to evil. They must be manipulated to do so, and both
Feanor and the Second Age Elven-smiths are snared by their pride in general
and their pride in the things they have made.
As for moral and other superiority both Feanor and Thingol and the
Númenoreans fell to evil in great part because they thought they possessed
it. Tolkien makes abundantly clear that even the Good Númenoreans are very
susceptible to pride in their supposed superiority. All real crises in the
history of Gondor are due to that flaw, and all their truly great leaders
are great because they overcome it. Much the same is true of the Elvish
leaders. It is certainly no accident that Elrond's least sympathetic trait
is his belief that his daughter is really too good for Aragorn. The closest
Tolkien comes to saying all this explicitly is Faramir's speech to Frodo,
but it is a very important theme in his work if you really look behind the
surface. The mental poisons of Morgoth, Sauron and the Orks are greed and
hate, which are simple flaws compared to pride and prejudice, which are the
mental poisons of Tolkien's Good characters, which the truly good overcome.
I'm sure Tolkien wanted to say something important about his contemporaries
here.

/bpj
Den 15 dec 2015 19:15 skrev "Mark J. Reed" <[log in to unmask]>:

> An interesting article. I had to wipe some disgust off my trousers after
> reading it, though.  The author seems to really have a hate-on for Dungeons
> and Dragons (and modern fantasy in general, but D&D in particular)..
>
> On Tue, Dec 15, 2015 at 12:11 PM, Jörg Rhiemeier <[log in to unmask]>
> wrote:
>
> > Hallo conlangers!
> >
> > On 15.12.2015 04:17, Padraic Brown wrote:
> >
> > I didn't wan't any kind of
> >> superficial fantasy type elves in The World and it's in part for that
> >> reason I know so little about the Teyor, the folk
> >> that perhaps most resemble Tolkien's ideas of what it is to be Elf.
> >>
> >
> > Fine. Nobody needs *yet another* instance of D&D-style Elves. What is
> more
> > interesting is an *original* treatment of Elves that casts a wholly new
> > light on them. I hope to achieve that through my Elvenpath project (of
> > which Old Albic, my main conlang, is a part). More on that below.
> >
> > I do have one poem written in Teyoran (though
> >> twas composed by a Daine speaker of the language):
> >>
> >> piario le dongwayos ngweliamme
> >> tange e eng rungyo!
> >> tange e eng nimmyo!
> >>
> >> tamtamme, sursurme, anyam le sangsangme
> >> eng tulliva!
> >> eng hardeva!
> >>
> >> gwelast i sayamang le swippim
> >> gwelast i sayamang le ratatarayim
> >> gwelast i sayamang le luopayim
> >>
> >> melli e enya tal eng shurcuyos erzhangme
> >> ta at enya tal tirio twecuiyyame!
> >>
> >
> > Sounds quite ... elvish to me ;)
> >
> > [...]
> >> I found this article to be helpful when considering the Teyor:
> >> http://www.bondwine.com/essays/33/whatiself.html
> >> Might come in useful for your considerations of the Andela!
> >>
> >
> > A very good and useful article that everybody should read before
> > attempting to build his own fantasy Elves!
> >
> > As for my own Elves, they are an attempt at expressing my own views of
> the
> > human condition, which are ultimately hopeful, and I wish to demonstrate
> > with the Elves what human beings can do. That, of course, is only
> > meaningful if all non-human or super-human traits are stripped off them,
> > which I do: my Elves are just human beings like you and me, no more, no
> > less. (This is also virtually the only way to plausibly fit them into the
> > history of "the real world".) They are in no way "ideal" or "saintly",
> they
> > have the same failings we all have; yet, they have learned to cope with
> > those failings in ways humanity as a whole can do, too.
> >
> > --
> > ... brought to you by the Weeping Elf
> > http://www.joerg-rhiemeier.de/Conlang/index.html
> > "Bêsel asa Éam, a Éam atha cvanthal a cvanth atha Éamal." - SiM 1:1
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Mark J. Reed <[log in to unmask]>
>