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söndag 21 februari 2016 skrev Kharon Alpua <[log in to unmask]>:

> I've actually taken (just this past month or so) to UTF-8 plaintext with
> Markdown following the CommonMark rules, though the lack of footnote and
> tables means some of my content needs to be adjusted in HTML or other
> publishing formats. I'm actually leaning towards using InDesign (as part of
> my schooling, I bought a license to Adobe CS6 with all of the products
> included), so I can get a lot of visual control over the format -- once the
> content is done, of course.
>
> My main tools under Windows 10 are Notepad++ (composing plaintext with or
> without markup), CodeBrowser (elastic tabstops for reviwing the CSV
> dictionaries), and Markdown Edit (live preview of my markdown composition).
> I store all of my dictionaries in a combination of CSV and OpenOffice
> Database (ODS), though I might set up my own SQL database (and maybe even a
> simple interface to manipulate it with) when I get to publishing online. I
> compose my fonts in Illustrator then build them in FontForge, and my plan
> for publishing my work is to use Dreamweaver for the live online version
> and InDesign to handle all of the fun page layout stuff for generating a
> PDF.
>
> Plaintext is a lifesaver: Any computer can handle it, and these days,
> there's little reason to not use UTF-8. You can include IPA in your text
> trivially -- as long as you keep ready access to the IPA symbols -- and
> every other computer will be able to read it too. I also strongly recommend
> that you grab a copy of the Croscore fonts (Cousine, Arimo, Tinos) or
> Google's Noto fonts for any and every language you need to use. Font
> support is the biggest challenge with IPA, but there are plenty of fonts
> out there (SIL makes a few useful ones too, and a keyboard layout for IPA
> if you use Windows).
>
> I do strongly agree, whoever you are, keep your data as accessible as
> possible. You can always go proprietary (if you like) when formatting time
> comes around, but keep the underlying data in a format you will have as
> much access to as possible. And since my day job is tutoring programming, I
> will also second the suggestion to learn a bit of simple programming that
> can help you out. Learn how to parse your data structure in an accessible
> scripting language, and maybe you can make some other useful utilities
> (never hurts to roll your own word generator that fits exactly what you
> want and need in your language).
>
> Sayu yanis!
> Kharon
>
>
> On Sun, Feb 21, 2016 at 9:02 AM, Melroch <[log in to unmask] <javascript:;>>
> wrote:
>
> > Watch it Logan, before you know it you'll be in your late forties and
> still
> > not know for sure what your verbal system is like!
> >
> > Your story is so much like mine. I started what eventually became Sohlob
> in
> > fifth grade (you are eleven y.o. in fifth grade in Sweden) mostly as a
> > bunch of names, even discovering the voiceless alveolar lateral fricative
> > on my own, tho I didn't realize it was a lateral until I studied
> Icelandic!
> > For better or worse I had a thirteen year hiatus in artlanging because
> when
> > I was fifteen my parents forbade the activity, as well as anything by or
> > about Tolkien, tout court. They were concerned about my grades, but my
> > mother said that what I did wasn't really sane and that was what stuck
> with
> > me. I did have problems with my grades in math and science but that was
> due
> > to dyscalculia. My math/chemistry teacher kind of understood because she
> > had had students with similar problems, but sadly she had no word for it,
> > nor any help to offer beyond understanding. Anyway I took the humanities
> > program in the _gymnasium_ (corresponding to High School) and got a
> > French/Latin teacher who was also an Esperantist -- author of *the*
> > Swedish--Esperanto dictionary -- auxlang creator, spelling reformer etc.
> so
> > soon enough I was immersed in a supposedly saner form of conlanging! My
> > 'auxlangs' were actually artlangs in disguise of course. No real
> auxlanger
> > would distinguish Latin short and long vowels by applying Romance-style
> > diphthongization to them! Then I took linguistics and comparative
> philology
> > at university and soon learnt that conlanging of all kinds was utterly
> > insane and taboo. Nevertheless when I got internet access at the by
> today's
> > standards advanced age of 29 I did pretty soon type "artificial language"
> > into the search engine du jour, found lots of websites and this list,
> > concluding that if conlanging was insane I was not alone. I also took to
> > heart Jeffrey Henning's argument that the relationship between natlangs
> and
> > conlangs and natlangs was like that between real and model railroads. Now
> > model railroading was an activity my parents had endorsed (my father and
> my
> > maternal grandfather had had a lot of fun with my model railroad), and
> > since my academic career had all but foundered anyway I subscribed to
> > CONLANG, AUXLANG and TolkLang all on the same day! I was eventually cured
> > from the auxlang bug thanks to our Ray Brown. I've still been at it with
> > Sohlob (which I kind of restarted about 20 years ago), and eventually let
> > my Romlang resurrect as Rhodrese after wasting too much time on
> bogolangs.
> > Alas the need to spend my professional life in front of a computer, the
> > fact that I periodically get hooked on sketch languages (invariably
> > starting with a phonology sketch!) and the accident of my Sohlob
> vocabulary
> > being locked into a proprietary database file for almost a decade (and
> not
> > looking so great when I eventually recovered it!) has halted development.
> > The problem with Rhodrese is that it more or less has ended up as Occitan
> > with French/Italian diphthongization. Still I find one aspect easier
> with a
> > natlang-derived conlang: it has become increasingly difficult to come up
> > with original vocabulary over the years, because I'm too good at spotting
> > unoriginality and because some favorite sound patterns tend  to
> overassert
> > themselves.
> >
> > Anyway if I have any advice to fellow conlangers, new or old it is to not
> > rely solely on proprietary file formats. Work on your vocabulary in a
> > spreadsheet or database if you like, but always save or at least back up
> to
> > some plain text based format like comma/tab separated values
> > (.csv/.tsv/.tab) or YAML, which latter is extremely readable to humans in
> > spite of being computer readable. Write your texts and grammars in a word
> > processor if you like, but save/back up as plaintext or HTML! I have to
> > plug for Pandoc <http://pandoc.org>, an excellent tool for converting
> > between light, readable plaintext markup formats like Markdown and
> > RestructuredText and heavier formats like HTML and LaTeX, even both ways
> to
> > a degree. It can also convert from text-based formats to PDF, ODT, RTF
> and
> > DOCX, and even has the beginnings of converting from DOCX. It has
> > revolutionized my professional and creative writing alike. (And you can
> > write filters to modify your documents during conversion in any
> programming
> > language which can read and write JSON!)
> >
> > And even if you are "not a programmer" I urge you to look at some high
> > level scripting language like Perl, Python or Ruby. They will be a
> > tremendous help when working on your plaintext based data, whether for
> > transforming or maintenance. I learnt Perl almost 25 years ago to help
> with
> > data mining in my comparative philology days, and it has proved of great
> > help ever since. I certainly did not consider myself a programmer at the
> > time, despite having dabbled as a teenager, but thankfully had a fellow
> > student with a programming background.
> >
> > /bpj
> > Den 15 feb 2016 19:34 skrev "Logan Kearsley" <[log in to unmask]
> <javascript:;>>:
> >
> > > On 14 February 2016 at 15:37, Kharon Alpua <[log in to unmask]
> <javascript:;>>
> > wrote:
> > > > Hello, everybody. I'm a dabbler with a focus on artlangs, well,
> mostly
> > on
> > > > one artlang. I was introduced to the idea of constructed languages by
> > way
> > > > of Lord of the Rings and Star Trek, and combined with a deep interest
> > in
> > > > fantasy, have been developing a fantasy world, and languages for it.
> > > > Though, as noted, mostly only one is in a usable state.
> > > >
> > > > I've been working on this language, which is called Adinjo (or
> Original
> > > > Adinjo, not to be confused with Proto-Adinjo which is my attempt to
> > > rebuild
> > > > the language in a diachronic manner) for between 15 and 17 years. We
> > > could
> > > > cut the difference and call it 16, but the earliest stages of it were
> > > very
> > > > disorganized and poorly documented.
> > > >
> > > > By the time I was 18-19, I was compiling a glossary. By my early 20s
> I
> > > > believe I had over 500 words. But my focus on the language waxed and
> > > waned,
> > > > and over the years, I had shifts in interests for how the language
> > > worked.
> > > > The earliest samples of it would probably be considered highly formal
> > by
> > > my
> > > > modern standards, and perhaps more than a bit out of date.
> > > >
> > > > By my mid-20s, I was trying to avoid Adinjo being a relex of
> English. I
> > > > adjusted the verbal forms a bit, and played whenever I could with
> bits
> > of
> > > > other languages, languages for wolfmen, lizardmen, and my worlds
> > versions
> > > > of Elves, Orcs, Dwarves, and Halflings. Most of those have minimal
> > > > glossaries at this point, but not much in terms of their linguistic
> > > > structure.
> > > >
> > > > I heard about this group from discussions on Conlangery, and joined
> to
> > > see
> > > > some more conlangs, discussions, and to have a place to share my
> > > languages.
> > > > I just thought it would be good to introduce myself before I started
> > > > chiming in or asking for thoughts.
> > >
> > > Hello! Your story has some similarities to mine- I've been working
> > > on-and-off on Celimine since around 5th grade (I'm now mid-20s) with
> > > periodic revisions to reflect slightly changing tastes and increasing
> > > linguistic knowledge.
> > > A big contributor to slowing down its development, though, is that I
> > > just can't keep focused on only one language. I just keep getting
> > > ideas for new ones, and there's never enough time to explore them
> > > all....
> > >
> > >
> > > -l.
> > >
> >
>