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Hi all

Does that samprasarana ( CwV > Cu or CjV > Ci ) occur elsewhere in Romance
at all? It does in fact elsewhere in Italic, but it seems unusual for
Romance. French does have plenty of words in -ie coming from Latin -ia, but
as far as I know these are all borrowings. Where does the final -o in
Sp/Port cinco come from?

That's not to say you shouldn't go that route - it does provide a nice
parallel with the other syllabic resonants. It also provides another option
for other Latin words in -ua, e.g. vidua > vedho or something similar. I
like -o orthographically, since that seems the normal spelling for other
unstressed /u/.

There is something very cool about _aug_ and _leung_ though - entirely
plausible since it is attested in relatives, but fairly exotic to those
like me who aren't well versed in the smaller Romance languages.


James Kane

On Tue, Feb 6, 2018 at 4:21 AM, Raymond Brown <[log in to unmask]>
wrote:

> On 05/02/2018 14:26, Pete Bleackley wrote:
>
>> staving Ray Brown:
>>
>>
>> Correct, and that only before /a/.  As for the finals, we might have
>>> expected _aque_ /'akwə/ and _lengue_ /'lengwə/ in early Britainese.  But
>>> the question arises about what happens when final [ə] falls sient in later
>>> Britainese.
>>>
>>
> OOPS - big mistake there!  I should have written _ague_ /'agwə/
>
> It seems that your two main options are either  w => u / C_# giving aku,
>> lengu
>>
>> Or kw, gw => p, b / _#
>>
>> giving ap, lemb
>>
>>
> Or rather _ab_ and _lemb_.  I like _ab_ and _lemb_ but, as I observed
> with vowels in an earlier email, it's not a question of what I like but
> of what is most/more plausible.
>
> I've been using Welsh, English and French as 'control languages' from
> our time-line in suggesting areal features or the sort of way that
> people on this island might have developed their Romancelang.
> Attractive as I may find _ab_ and _lemb_, I think something along the
> lines of _agʷ_ and _lengʷ_ is more plausible.
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> On 05/02/2018 14:35, And Rosta wrote:[snip]
>
>>
>> IIRC in Britainese a final postconsonantal liquid CL# <  CL@#
>> becomes syllabic, or, equivalently, is reanalysed as [log in to unmask]
>>
>
> Yes, becomes syllabic (which _may_ be realized as short svarabhakti
> vowel before the liquid).
>
> By analogy with that, rather than actual Romance exemplars, I would
>> predict /ak[u]/ and /leng[u]/. (But perhaps still /akw-/ and
>> /lengw-/ when vowel-initial suffixes follow.)
>>
>
> Yes, I must think on this.   As vowel /u/ had shifted to /y/ and then
> /i/, the spellings _agu_ and _lengu_ won't do.  I suppose analogy with
> _padre_ -> _padr_ and _homne_ -> _homn_ should mean _agw_ and _lengw_
> respectively - um, looks a bit Welsh.  ;)
>
> Ray
>