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Ubimiizhe, ta Itlanit shol idalán nesmidit karizhe ra-onyara! Sholnirdiór
ra-onyaru idakín pashni ta kaalilu vey ta zakhishilu korunyaru (ishyaru u
idá kulizhe ranirit onyara). Etikhyaru u chadit savansholú rafrelit onyaren
veybá yagusizhe ta "odnokovó" ra-azburyaren. Djufi-bolo nobshetya makayaren
idaova kiinova vutit eyparú harvolyaren. Bezyara u idá ta pureri resh ta
Itlanit sholey onyara: "Kesh nobshetya makayara idaova kiinova ruvya
vemyaru?" Kashá khay, iskemyara.

Djurumyaru u ta arsoronit kavisuesea degilya ra-makayaru.

So Itlani is not so weird after all! I am not a linguist so I do a lot on
instinct and intuition alone (not at all scientific, I know). I suspect
that many natlangs are deficient and/or break the "rules" in various ways
and still manage to communicate what their speakers want to say. That seems
to be my criterion for Itlani, "Can it communicate what I want to say?" If
yes, it's working.

I apologize for not being able to contribute to the more technical
conversations. :0

Itlani Jim

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 5:42 AM, <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> This is also the case in Udmurt, which is still mostly SOV (there are
> cases when nouns get moved to after the verb though).
>
> The Finno-Ugric languages were historically SOV, although the word order
> of many modern languages has changed drastically. Nevertheless, we still
> see demonstratives occurring before nouns in all the languages I’ve
> studied, even those with suffixed definiteness markers.
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On Feb 23, 2018, at 05:19, Aidan Aannestad <[log in to unmask]>
> wrote:
> >
> > Technically in Japanese you can also put demonstratives after any
> > modifiers, though it sounds a bit more literary that way.
> >
> > Thus:
> >
> > kono takai yama
> > this tall.ADNOM mountain
> >
> > Or
> >
> > takai kono yama
> > tall.ADNOM this mountain
> >
> > Both are valid for 'this tall mountain'; the second is somewhat higher
> > register.
> >
> > 2018/02/22 21:55 "David Peterson" <[log in to unmask]>:
> >
> >> It's the usual way, if the demonstratives function similar to modifiers:
> >> the modifiers come first.
> >>
> >> On Thu, Feb 22, 2018 at 5:55 PM, Sylvia Sotomayor <[log in to unmask]>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>> I have a question regarding word order and OV languages.
> >>>
> >>> The latest draft of the new language is mostly verb-final. The basic
> word
> >>> order is SOV. The structure of the verb phrase itself is
> >> Subject-Proclitic
> >>> - Verb - Inflection. The inflection part codes tense, evidentiality,
> >> person
> >>> of subject and person of object. While the subject proclitic marks
> person
> >>> and number, the inflection only marks person. Also, in some cases the
> >> forms
> >>> of the inflections have fallen together, so that without a subject
> >>> proclitic you have no idea if the inflection -ñe means non-past, second
> >>> person subject, no object OR recent past, direct evidentiality, first
> >>> person subject, no object OR recent past, direct evidentiality, third
> >>> person subject with first person object. Since subject and to a certain
> >>> extent object are marked in the verb phrase itself, the actual noun
> >> phrases
> >>> for S and O do not have to be expressed.
> >>>
> >>> The language also has copulas, and those come between the copula
> subject
> >>> and the copula complement.
> >>>
> >>> Within a typical noun phrase, the word order goes: (adjective) noun
> >>> (generic noun) (postposition). I also have demonstratives. My
> preference
> >> is
> >>> to put the demonstrative first: dem adj noun generic. I suspect this is
> >> not
> >>> the usual OV language word order. But I like it. Especially when I have
> >>> something like demonstrative relative-clause relative-pronoun noun
> >>> generic-noun resumptive-demonstrative COPULA noun.
> >>>
> >>> So, the question: how unnatural is it to have a demonstrative at the
> >>> beginning of a noun phrase in an OV language? And should I care?
> >>>
> >>> (OK, that last is a rhetorical question).
> >>>
> >>> -S
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Sylvia Sotomayor
> >>>
> >>> The sooner I fall behind the more time I have to catch up.
> >>>
> >>
>