On Mon, 11 Feb 2019, 00:16 David Peterson <[log in to unmask] wrote:

> Ah. Then the sound is [ʎ̟]. (I.e. a palatal fricative but advanced.)

That's my answer too, except on my screen I see only the diacritic of
advancement (making the palatal dorsopostalveolar) and not the diacritic of
greater closure (making the approximant a fricative).  [ʎ̟̝] (with two
stacked diacritics) displays correctly on my screen.


> Sent from my iPhone
> > On Feb 10, 2019, at 4:05 PM, Tony Harris <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> >
> > Tongue tip is near the *lower* teeth just because that's where it ends
> up in order to put the rest of the tongue where it needs to be.  Sound
> production is done by placing the tongue body against the post-alveolar
> area.  I could be persuaded the tongue body is actually touching the
> alveolar ridge (although when I compare other known alveolar sounds I can
> tell the tongue body isn't touching the same place), but it's definitely
> not retroflex *or* dental, unless the sheer fact of the tongue tip being
> near any teeth is enough to make it dental.
> >
> > I guess the lesson for me here is that I'm being way too perfectionist
> and looking for the exact, perfect, correct IPA symbol, when it doesn't
> really have to be that.
> >
> > It's also actually kind of cool that it seems phoneme I've had in
> Alurhsa since its conception doesn't seem to be in use by any natlang.
> Makes me feel warm and fuzzy inside. :)
> >
> >
> >
> >> On 19-02-10 18:35, David Peterson wrote:
> >> Wait, hang on. I misread. If the tongue tip is at or near the teeth
> it’s dental. If the tongue body is high, though, can’t you just say it’s
> [-anterior]?
> >>
> >> Sent from my iPhone
> >>
> >>>> On Feb 10, 2019, at 3:12 PM, Tony Harris <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> On 19-02-10 17:57, David McCann wrote:
> >>>> On Sun, 10 Feb 2019 14:07:50 -0500
> >>>> Tony Harris <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> I need some advice from the IPA experts here.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> However, studying my way through the latest IPA chart
> >>>>> (
> >>>>> I am at a loss how to represent a voiced antero-dorsal post-alveolar
> >>>>> lateral approximant.  (And, as I've said before, I am not a trained
> >>>>> linguist, nor do I pretend to be one, so I hope I'm using the terms
> >>>>> in a meaningful way...)
> >>>> In many Australian languages you get a 4-way contrast generated by
> >>>> dental vs post-alveolar and apical vs laminal. For the laminal
> >>>> post-alveolar, Ladefoged used ḻ (underlined l). But don't forget that
> >>>> you can always use the nearest available symbol, so the palatal
> lateral
> >>>> ʎ could be used if Alurhsa doesn't have one.
> >>> Doesn't just using the nearest available symbol sort of defeat the
> purpose of the IPA being a way to accurately represent the sounds? I mean,
> wouldn't you have to then include a description that essentially says "for
> this language the symbol /x/ means this, not what the IPA says it means"?
> >>>
> >>> Maybe I'm being to perfectionist. Hmm.