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Je 10:02 atm 9/7/98 -0700, Rob PETRY skribis:
 
>Ti-ci es por Michael:
>
>Jardinero e caldronero.
>
>Unquande un jardinero e un caldronero promenat junt tra un
>cauliera. "Vi!" li caldronero dit, "quam grand caul-capes cresce
>sur ti agre." -- "Tu trova que ili es grand?" replicat li
>jardinero. -- "Yo cultivat unquande un caul-cap tam grand quam un
>dom!" Li caldronero respondet: "Possibil, ma yo forjat unquande
>un caldron tam grand quam un eclesia". Alor li jardinero ridente
>dit: "Oh! fanfaron, tu menti e ne mem rubija. Di me, por quo tu
>besonat un tam grand caldron?" =3D=3D "In it yo volet cocinar tui
>supervoluminosi caul-cap..." li caldronero replicat.
>
Nice joke. And I got the punch line immediately (in the "Scottish blood"
joke I was actually writing to complain when I finally figured out --
thinking about "efiki" in Esperanto -- what "ha efectet" meant...). There
are a couple of things that pass over my head, though:
 
(1) "cauliera" and "caul-capes"? From context, I'm assuming "cabbages". The
exact translation is not, however, essential to understanding the point of
the joke.
 
(2) "tu menti e ne mem rubija"? Not a clue.
 
Esperanto version:
 
>Jardinero e caldronero.
>
>Unquande un jardinero e un caldronero promenat junt tra un
>cauliera. "Vi!" li caldronero dit, "quam grand caul-capes cresce
>sur ti agre." -- "Tu trova que ili es grand?" replicat li
>jardinero. -- "Yo cultivat unquande un caul-cap tam grand quam un
>dom!" Li caldronero respondet: "Possibil, ma yo forjat unquande
>un caldron tam grand quam un eclesia". Alor li jardinero ridente
>dit: "Oh! fanfaron, tu menti e ne mem rubija. Di me, por quo tu
>besonat un tam grand caldron?" =3D=3D "In it yo volet cocinar tui
>supervoluminosi caul-cap..." li caldronero replicat.
>
=D8ardenisto kaj kaldronisto
 
=D8ardenisto kaj kaldronisto iam kune promenis tra brasikejo. "Vidu!" diris
la kaldronisto, "kiom grandaj brasikoj kreskas sur tiu agro." -- "Vi trovas
ilin grandaj?" respondis la =F8ardenisto. -- "Mi iam kultivis brasikon tiel
grandan kiel domon!" Respondis la kaldronisto: "Eble, sed mi iam for=F8is
kaldronon tiel grandan kiel pre=F8ejon*." La =F8ardenisto ridante tiam diris=
:
"Ha! Blago,** [...]. Diru al mi, por kio vi bezonis tiel grandan
kaldronon?" -- "Mi volis kuiri en =F8i vian brasikegon..." respondis la
kaldronisto.
 
* The word "eklezio" also exists in Esperanto, but refers to the entirety
of beliefs, administrative apparatus, membership and organization of a
particular belief-set, and would be inappropriate here. Although...
 
Incidentally, "tiel grandan kiel domon" might more aptly, but less
traditionally, be expressed as "dome grandan". Similarly, "pre=F8eje=
 grandan".
 
** The word "fanfarono" also exists in Esperanto, and is appropriate here
-- it refers to self-glorification -- but I sort of preferred "blago" (a
joking lie -- the auld blarney).
 
>^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>
>Lingue Figurativ
>
Nice set of metaphors and aphorisms. I venture to suspect that in at least
a few cases the Occidental versions remain more applicable in 1998 than the
English versions. One or two comments:
 
>To whet one's whistle.
>Rinsar se li gurgul.
 
I don't think this expression is very much used any more in English. The
Esperanto is not be dissimilar to the Occidental: "Tralavi la gor=F8on".
>
>To come to the end of one's tether.
>Esser al fine de su corde.
 
I think "esser" is a mistranslation here. While it suggests simple state,
the English indicates cessation of previous movement. Isn't there a verb,
"atinyer" or something like that, that might better show this?
 
>To be fed up with something.
>Esser satiat de alquo'.
 
Again, I don't think (and on this I could be wrong) that "satiat" satisfies
the needs of the English version. The Occidental seems to mean that one has
reached the limits of what one will accept; the English implies a
counterreaction as well. "Sati=F8i =F8isna=FDze" might be a reasonable Esper=
anto
translation; I suspect something similar can be done in Occidental.
>
>You don't know Jack ----.
>Oops, sorry, this isn't included. ;--)))
>
Why not? In some circles, this could prove a useful expression.;<)
=20
 
-- Don HARLOW
http://www.webcom.com/~donh/
(English version: http://www.webcom.com/~donh/dona.html)