I tried sending this on thursday last week, but it never seemed to=20 reach the list, so here's the second attempt :) > Message-ID:<[log in to unmask]> > Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 08:55:52 +0100 (GMT-1) > From: Irina Rempt <[log in to unmask]> > Subject: A new translation exercise (was: lexicons) ka=ECrfa=EC a gva=ECr ka=ECrfa=ECdudjal:; i:ru djinra e=ECcavy i: xvua=ECc ry=FA's; rael:ia a=F2 i: xvu 'ryc; syel:ia a=F2 i: xvu ly=E8's; ju:ar:in: vaeren a ka=ECrfa=EC ct'a=EBlan: i:el 'syardris djin xvu ksy's; k'a:on; ta'aon; brenon; a tiron i:ruel ksy'seles tca'ra ge=E0lar:ei=F0 ga=ECnrui=F0 e=ECcai=F0es "Grandfather and the dragon When my great-great-grandfather was a young man, he travelled out into the world. First he went west; there was only sand there. Then he went north; there was only snow there. Then he went east; there the mountains were too high and great-great-grandfather couldn't climb them. At last he decided to travel south, on foot, on horseback, by cart and=20 by boat. In the south he saw the largest city in all the world." Orthographic and phon(etic|ologic) notes: Vowels with accents form a diphthong with the preceding vowel. If the=20 accent is a grave, the unmarked vowel is the dominant one, the opposite=20 is the case if the accent is an acute. Umlauts are used only to disambi- guate homonymous morphemes. Colon marks the preceding sound for length, semi-colon is a short pause like our comma, apostrophe marks breathiness/ devoicing if placed before a sound and aspiration if placed after. /g/ is always hard, the /r/ is an alveolar trill, /u/ is nicked from Norwegian, everybody seems to mix them up with the French <u> in <lune>, which is in fact closer to the /y/ than the /u/, both are rounded, the /y= / more so. /c/ is a post-alveolar fricative (or retroflex s, take yer pick)= ,=20 /j/ is voiced /c/, the /a/ is more backed than mid, the /x/ is an un- voiced, velar approximant and thus not -quite- like in Scottish <Loch>, the /o/ is what the rest of the world knows as /u/. The Interminable Interlinear, for those who like such things: Cryptic abbreviations: 4 the number four 3s.+ third singular animate LOC.g marks located thing LOC marks location, more or less exactly PAST past tense :) PL plural EXP experiencer, see [*] INSTR instrumental (not comitative!) BEN bene-/malefactive, dative, catch-all oblique, see [*] =09 ka=ECrfa=EC a gva=ECr ka=ECr - fa=EC a gva=ECr 4 - parent and "dragon" "Grandfather and the dragon" ka=ECrfa=ECdudjal:; i:ru ka=ECr - fa=EC -du =3Ddjal: i: -ru 4 - parent -young =3Dtime_of 3s.+ -LOC.g djinra e=ECcavy djin -ra e=ECca -vy travel -PAST world -LOC.moving.fixed "When my great-great-grandfather was a young man, he travelled out into the world." i: xvua=ECc ry=FA's; rael:ia i: xvu -a=ECc ry=FA's rael: =3Dia 3s.+ approach -first west sand =3Dland.of "First he went west; there was only sand there." a=F2 i: xvu 'ryc; syel:ia a=F2 i: xvu 'ryc syel: =3Dia and.then 3s.+ approach north snow =3Dland.of "Then he went north; there was only snow there." a=F2 i: xvu ly=E8's; ju:ar:in: a=F2 i: xvu ly=E8's ju: -ar:e -in: and.then 3s.+ approach east high -most -too_much vaeren a ka=ECrfa=EC vaer -en a ka=ECr - fa=EC mountain -PL and 4 - parent ct'a=EBlan: -=EB- ct'a =3Dlan: -not- pass =3Dcapable.of "Then he went east; there the mountains were too high and great-great-grandfather couldn't climb them." i:el 'syardris djin xvu ksy's; k'a:on; ta'aon; i: -el 'syard' -ris djin xvu ksy's k'a: -on ta'a -on 3s.+ -EXP decide -last travel approach south foot -INSTR ride -INSTR=20 brenon; a tiron bren -on a tir -on car -INSTR and ship -INSTR "At last he decided to travel south, on foot, on horseback, by cart and b= y boat." i:ruel ksy'seles tca'ra i: -ru -el ksy's -el -es tca' -ra 3s.+ -LOC.g -EXP south -EXP -LOC see -PAST ge=E0lar:ei=F0 ga=ECnrui=F0 e=ECcai=F0es ge=E0l -ar:e -i=F0 ga=ECn -ru -i=F0 e=ECca -i=F0 -es big -most -BEN city -LOC.g -BEN world -BEN -LOC "In the south he saw the largest city in all the world." [*] The experiencer (EXP) marks the subject, if an agent and animate=20 of verbs of the experiencer paradigm. Experiencer-verbs (daft name but I haven't bothered looking for a better one yet) functions as conjunction= s, some experiencer-verbs are: think, consider, feel, hate, love... When the experiencer-verb only governs a phrase and not a new sentence, that phrase is marked with the benefactive (BEN).=20 Example: sa:el a:r u: te=EC i:a=FE I-EXP thinks.that you love he/she-PAT (PAT patient) u:el te=EC i:i=F0 you-EXP love he/she-BEN Valid permutations: 'S' subordinated sentence/benefactive 'V' experiencer-verb 'E' experiencer E V S V E S S V E tal.